Act Three
19HHH) "I can. I was just being polite." INVITATIONS: See 7E and 7GG.
19III) "And don't lie to me. I'm tired of it." TO LIE OR NOT TO LIE: "She says the exact opposite to Giles later (see 19Kx4)."--Tchaikovsky, Thurs, 02/06/03 at 14:50:50
19JJJ) "I love you. I don't know if I can trust you." LINKAGE: "...[H]er reaction here to Angel seems very similar to what she told Spike in Seeing Red. Carrying it further, the same issue is central to Conversations with Dead People."--Sophist, Thurs, 02/06/03 at 13:30:01
19LLL) "Maybe I'm the one who should decide!" THE BUFFY/ANGEL DYNAMIC: "Another interesting moment in the power dynamic of B/A. He uses his greater age and experience to his advantage, trying to make decisions about what Buffy should know. At the same time Angel's insecurities and fears of rejection come through -- he makes Buffy admit her love for him before he tells her about Dru."--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15
19MMM)
"First I made her insane." THE MADNESS OF DRU: "Angel
believes that he is responsible for Drusilla's madness, and certainly Angelus
was a key factor in driving the young woman over the edge. But Drusilla is neither
frothing-at-the-mouth mad, nor is she simply an excitable psychotic. And she
displays no genuine disdain for the vampire who aided and abetted her mental
breakdown (see 19E). The sort of insanity
she displays has a very organic quality which isn't the insanity of psychological
trauma alone. She seems locked into perceiving the world around her in limited,
specific ways, with moments of lucidity that come and go.
One of the ways she perceives the world is through the lens of her psychic ability.
When her visions are in full swing, she cannot communicate her thoughts, sensations,
and feelings to others outside the language of this lens. Another way she perceives
the world is through the lens of a child. Even after she recovers her vampire
strength, she still allows others around her to treat her like a little girl
only concerned with dolls and games. It is possible, therefore, that Angelus
tipped the scales for a young woman who already had a propensity towards schitzophrenia."--Masquerade,
"Lie to Me" Analysis, from http://www.atpobtvs.com
ANGEL/US: "There is no clearer example of the blurred distinction between Angel and Angelus than Angel's 'confession' to Buffy [here]...After killing the mortal Drusilla's entire family and taunting her into madness, Angelus turned her into a vampire. Angel is understandably reluctant about sharing this story with Buffy, but was Angel responsible for Drusilla's fate? --Masquerade, "Lie to Me" Analysis, from http://www.atpobtvs.com See 7OO.
MARTI SPEAKS: Drusilla "represents to Angel the epitome of his bad behavior. She is one of his greater works of art."--Marti Noxon, "What's My Line, Part 2" DVD Commentary See 33UU-33DDD.
19NNN) The camera circles them as they talk. VISUAL SYMBOLISM: "The constant movement of the camera in the scene suggests the changing of perspectives. Buffy's off-kilter, not sure of who to trust, Ford is lying, the camera work and harsh lighting represent the dramatic shift in their relationship."--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15
19OOO) Cut to later at the stairs in the hall. FROM THE ORIGINAL SHOOTING SCRIPT: The original script contained a short scene of Cordy asking Willow about Ford. When Will asks her why she's interested, she says, "In case you haven't noticed there is a devastating cute guy shortage right now. The government is calling for rationing so why does Buffy get to hoard them all? She has Angel." She quickly loses interest when she's informed that Ford's into vampires. This scene was obviously chopped since the whole Cordy subplot was excised from the final product (see 19NN).--"Lie to Me" by Joss Whedon, available through Pocketbooks, Inc. as Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Script Book, Season Two, Volume 2
19PPP) "Angel was in your bedroom?" BIG-BROTHER XANDER: It's very sweet that Xander is just as disturbed about Angel having been in Willow's room as he was about him being in Buffy's room (see 7J). Although Xander doesn't think of Will the same way he does Buffy, he is protective over her, like a big brother, and doesn't want "Dead Boy" in her room either.
19QQQ) "Ours is a forbidden love." THE WILLOW/ANGEL 'SHIP: "…[T]his line, (particularly how Alyson Hannigan reads it), is just wonderful. It reminds me vaguely of the chemistry she had with Marc Blucas, to the point where Doug Petrie says in The Initiative commentary that they had to be careful not to push the Willow/Riley thing too much in case the audience got the wrong idea."--Tchaikovsky, Thurs, 02/06/03 at 14:50:50
19RRR) "I'm sorry, Ford. I'm rash and impulsive. It's a flaw." LINKAGE: One could also say the same about Spike.
19SSS) "Everybody lies." MAIN THEME FROM "LIE TO ME": "He's right. Everyone in this episode lies to the people closest to them at some point, either by keeping secrets or by trying to deceive them, ostensibly for the other person's good."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12
19TTT) "You were gonna offer them a trade!" BUFFY SMART: See 2L.
19UUU) "We're going to ascend to a new level of consciousness! Become like them." RELIGION: "The Sunset Club cult can be interpreted as another example of the atheist Joss's view on spirituality and religion. Rarely does he address belief in the major religions, but his cynical view on organized religion can be seen in his treatment of cults (such as this episode) and in other ‘feel-good’ offers of answers and spiritual solace (see Anne--35JJJ--and Disharmony). But perhaps the best description of Joss's views are that easy answers to complex problems are never a good thing."--Tyreseus, Fri, 02/07/03 at 14:52:56
19VVV) "No one gets outta here alive." MUSICALLY SPEAKING: "…[T]his is a Jim Morrison quote. It refers to the idea of life itself - that none of us will leave it any way other than death. Of course Ford and the other Sunset Club members think that they have found a way around this."--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15
The phrase comes from The Doors [Jim Morrison's band's] song, Five to One, first heard on their Waiting for the Sun LP:
Five to one, baby
One in five
No one here gets out alive
You get yours, baby
I'll get mine
Gonna make it, baby
If we try
The old get old
And the young get stronger
May take a week
And it may take longer
They got the guns
But we got the numbers
Gonna win, yeah
We're takin' over
Come on!
Yeah!
Your ballroom days are over, baby
Night is drawing near
Shadows of the evening crawl across the years
Ya walk across the floor with a flower in your hand
Trying to tell me no one understands
Trade in your hours for a handful dimes
Gonna' make it, baby, in our prime
Come together one more time
Get together one more time
Hey, c'mon, honey
You won't have along wait for me, baby
I'll be there in just a little while
You see, I gotta go out in this car with these people and...
Get together one more time
Get together one more time....
Superficially, it might seem as if Morrison is advocating the triumph of youth culture over the tired Old Guard (which sort of ties into the Vampire Cult of this episode); but more likely, he's just macking on some babe while cruising along Hollywood boulevard."--cjl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 08:47:50
"It may or may not be a coincidence that Morrison’s non-admirers tend to view him as a self-indulgent mythologizer of adolescent morbidity."--KdS, Fri, 02/07/03 at 05:34:32
OR...: "Maybe Morrison. But Joss is a film buff, and I think Morrison was slighlty misquoting [the 1963 Paul Newman film,] Hud...'Happens to everybody. Horses, dogs, men. Nobody gets out of life alive.'" The screenplay was by Irving Ravetch and Harriet Frank.--dream of the consortium, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:44:19
Act Four
19WWW) Diego is offended. Chantarelle smiles. FORESHADOWY GOODNESS: Although we don't learn much more about Chantarelle/Lily/Anne in this episode, this little smile to Buffy can be seen as foreshadowing her attachment to her in Anne. Although she's not there yet, a little glimmer of being able to think of herself is peering in here (see 35Ex4).
19XXX) "You're what we call the bad guy." BLACK AND WHITE: Notice how at this point in the episode, Buffy is still trying to define good and bad in their clearest terms. Just as Ford set up this elaborate fantasy in his head, casting himself as the bad guy, so does Buffy first brand him thusly. Soon, however, she will come to realize that human good and evil isn't always so cut and dried (see 19Lx4).
19YYY) "Well, I've got a news flash for you, braintrust..." ISN'T IT IRONIC?: A subtle detail is how Buffy insults Ford by calling him "braintrust" only moments before learning that he has brain cancer.
19ZZZ) "You die, and a demon sets up shop in your old house, and it walks, and it talks, and it remembers your life, but it's not you." BUFFYVERSE MYTHOLOGY: The old Council party-line. See 2LL and 2MM.
19Ax4) "It'll be bald and shriveled and it'll smell bad." FEAR OF AGING: "Ford's description of his death is an excellent description of both the results of cancer and chemotherapy and the results of aging. Ford has already expressed a fear of growing old and unattractive earlier with the comment that becoming a vampire will allow him and the wannabes to die young and stay pretty (see 19HH)."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12
19Bx4) "You're opting for mass murder here, and nothing you say is gonna make that okay!" ETHICS: "This idea has come up in Inca Mummy Girl and Prophecy Girl, what is the point when self-determination- one's own survival- is in conflict with the needs of others? Obviously Ford, by attempting to offer the lives of Buffy and the others in place of his own, is on the evil side of the equation. But as he points out morality often gets lost in the face of great pain and fear."--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15
19Cx4) "This is not the mothership, people!" E.T., PHONE HOME: "[A] reference to the Heaven's Gate cult. Thirty-nine members committed mass suicide on March 26, 1997 in the belief that a mothership traveling in the tail of a comet would come, retrieve their spirits, and take them to a state of utter bliss and immortality."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12
"...[A]lso [a reference] to the sci-fi influenced funk music of George Clinton’s P-funk groups, whose concerts would often climax with the arrival of the mystical funk-bringing alien Mothership."--KdS, Fri, 02/07/03 at 05:34:32
19Dx4) He falls unconscious to the floor. FROM THE ORIGINAL SHOOTING SCRIPT: "As Ford comes around the couch for a third hit. She grabs the bar, wrenches it free and slams Ford head first into a pillar. He drops like a sack of unconscious person."--"Lie to Me" by Joss Whedon, available through Pocketbooks, Inc. as Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Script Book, Season Two, Volume 2
19Ex4) "It's gonna be alright, baby. Let them go!" LOVE: "Given the usual vampire social behaviour, it shows how much Spike cares about Dru, and how strong his vestigial human morality still is, that he’s willing to order the other vampires to stop the attack when Buffy threatens her. The typical vampire point of view would probably be ‘OK, kill her, whatever’. It’s also a remarkable testimony to Spike’s strength of personality that the other vamps obey him and don’t tear him limb from limb when his susceptibility leads to them losing their meal."--KdS, Fri, 02/07/03 at 05:34:32
19Fx4) "Down the stairs." STAIR SYMBOLISM: "The first of many stairs and basements that will appear in Buffy and Spike's relationship. Buffy is as always above Spike. Here Buffy shoves Drusilla from her place above the fray, foreshadowing her fall from the pedestal in Spike's mind. Interestingly Buffy is one of the few people who keeps her word in this episode that deals with trust. It may be that Buffy's honouring of the exchange of Dru's life for the others that lays the groundwork for Spike making the truce with her in Becoming."--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15
19Gx4) "For the body." PHILOSOPHICAL DEBATEY GOODNESS: "I do believe that Buffy bears a measure of responsibility for Ford’s death. Saving him would have been difficult and placed her in danger, and the situation was entirely his fault, but she makes a conscious decision not to make any effort to save him. Moreover, she talks to the others in such a way as to give them the impression that he’s already dead. I see her actions as fairly comparable to Angel’s in Reunion [locking an entire room full of evil, but human, lawyers with Darla and Drusilla, for them to devour all but two of them], and I think that it is notable that we have never seen any explicit fallout from Buffy’s decision here, while Angel’s took the rest of the season to deal with."--KdS, Fri, 02/07/03 at 05:34:32
"The situation in Lie To Me...is very different than the one in Reunion:
1. Ford's plan was to be killed by vampires. The Lawyers did not plan to die at the hands of Drusilla and Darla.
2. Ford does not ask Buffy for help, but instead betrays her and after being told the stupidity of his plan, he continues with it and attempts to stop Buffy from saving the lives of the others. The Lawyers, on the other hand, ask for Angel's help and desire to live.
3. Ford is dying of a terminal illness and does not want to live. During the entire episode, Ford never fears Spike, the vampire who kills him, even when Spike vamps out to kill in the Sunset Club. Ford is actually excited about it. The Lawyers are completely terrified of Dru and Darla when the prospect of their deaths becomes an issue.
4. Buffy attempts to set Ford straight during the episode. She gives him a way out multiple times, but he refuses her help and actually actively fights her attempts to save the others. The Lawyers are begging for help and Angel says 'I can't seem to care' which is a statement Buffy definitely would not have said to Ford and she shows that with her actions.
All in all, Buffy tried hard and failed. Maybe she could have and should have tried harder, but sometimes people just don't want to be saved. I agree there is some moral ambiguity there but it is not in the same league as Angel's actions is Reunion."--Dan The Man, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:27:44
"I see this as closer to what Buffy is about to do regarding Spike. No immediate danger of death in Spike's case (except if they don't fix the chip). But in both cases, Buffy chooses a course for another, in murky situations. Ford has a certain right to self-determination. He IS going to die and Buffy cannot change that, cannot save him (shades of Joyce and Cassie [from Help]). All she can do is decide whether to interfere in Ford's choice of how to die. He wants to be a vampire. She knows that she has the cure for vampirism. And she provides him with that, when he needs it. Grim, but in my humble opinion, not comparable to the act of locking a dozen or so (evil) lawyers in a room with two vampires that you really really want dusted anyway."--Vickie, Fri, 02/07/03 at 10:35:17
19Hx4) "Really he was just scared." LINKAGE: "Again, the description fits the Nerd Troika (see 19EEE)--right down to the fear that Warren felt as he died."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12
19Ix4) "I believe that's called growing up." THE GREYING OF THE BUFFYVERSE: "The world is no longer black and white. The greying of the Buffyverse begins here. It's fair to describe this episode, and this passage in particular, as establishing the fundamental theme of the show hereafter."--Sophist, Thurs, 02/06/03 at 13:30:01
"A Buffy-Giles bonding moment. Characteristic of Giles' 'playing the father', he here refuses to offer Buffy simple answers, to impose his belief of the right thing to do. He is to do this again equally powerfully at the end of Innocence."--Tchaikovsky, Thurs, 02/06/03 at 14:50:50
19Jx4) "I know the feeling." RELATING: "This section delineated one of the recurring motifs of the series--growing up, with its accompanying moral dilemmas and moral quandries. It's significant that even the most mature grownup on the show, Rupert Giles, knows what it is like to wish that he could stop being mature for a bit while still accepting that this isn't possible."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12 See 5SS.
19*2) Ford suddenly rises from his grave, a vampire just like he wanted... WHY DID SPIKE SIRE FORD?: "...[H]e did it as a combination of revenge and poetic justice. Ford was unable to deliver on his part of the bargain. Yet Ford still wanted Spike to deliver on his. The obvious revenge would be to merely kill Ford. Recall that Ford hatched his little plan to achieve immortality (due to his illness). Ford was willing to sacrifice his friends (including Buffy) solely to serve his own needs. The poetic justice is that Spike did deliver on his part of the bargain, and yet still denied Ford his immortality, because Spike knew good and well that Buffy would dust Ford. At the very moment that Ford achieved his fondest desire, he loses it all. This is why Spike sired Ford."--Robert, Fri, 04/18/03 at 14:38:45
19Kx4) "Lie to me." MAIN THEME FROM "LIE TO ME": "Earlier in the show, Buffy told Angel, 'And don't lie to me. I'm tired of it...I can take it. I can take the truth.' Buffy has learned that the truth can be ambiguous, painful and unsettling. She may not agree with Angel's assessment, 'Some lies are necessary,' but she does know that there are some lies which are comforting...even if she can't quite believe them anymore. The entire episode focuses on lies, secrets and deceptions between people who are supposed to be very close to one another, and how deeply those lies can hurt, even though the liar may not intend to hurt anyone. At the same time, the truth may make people free...but it can hurt just as terribly as lies can. No easy answers are presented; the focus is on accepting truth, no matter how terrible, and cherishing life, however brief it may be."--Rhys, Sat, 02/08/03 at 03:12:12
CONTINUITY CHECK: Interestingly, these revelations occur immediately before The Dark Age, when Buffy learns the darker side of Giles (see 20Bx4).
19Lx4) "...the bad guys are easily distinguished by their pointy horns or black hats..." MORAL AMBIGUITY: "I don’t think that this speech is intended to refer to moral ambiguity in relation to demons as it is often interpreted. I don’t believe that there is any moral ambiguity in the general treatment of the inhuman in BtVS at this point, and it should be noted that the main plot of the episode is an attack on the idea of 'good vampires'. I think that the final scene is intended specifically to deal with the moral ambiguities and difficulties created by the existence of human evil, and the moral inadvisability of treating it in the way that demonic evil is treated in the series."--KdS, Fri, 02/07/03 at 05:34:32
19Mx4) "No one ever dies, and everybody lives happily ever after." HAPPY ENDINGS: "If ever there was a mission statement for BtVS the disproving of Giles pretty lie would be it!"--ponygirl, Fri, 02/07/03 at 09:36:15